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Author Topic: Automatic Waterers revisited....  (Read 779 times)

kckc

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Re: Automatic Waterers revisited....
« Reply #15 on: November 05, 2015, 10:32:43 am »

I know some people who rented a jackhammer type thing to get through some sort of granite rock but I really don't know how it worked.  The other option is like they do in Alaska and some places if you can't quite get deep enough - I recall them running some sort of heat strip or something along the water line, another was a really funky insulated pipe around the water pipe.  I'm sure there are other things that you might find.  I can't recall how deep they had to go but I recall being amazed how deep it was. 
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Karen

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Re: Automatic Waterers revisited....
« Reply #16 on: November 06, 2015, 08:48:26 am »

Thanks Karen!  After you mentioned heat tape, I did a little research and found several options for heated pipes.  John is researching what our best/most economical option is, but we should be able to come up with something without bringing in several dump trucks of soil, and worrying about messing up our drainage (fix one problem, create another?). 

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Karen

kckc

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Re: Automatic Waterers revisited....
« Reply #17 on: November 06, 2015, 09:32:36 am »

great... I read too that actually bringing in dirt may not actually work since it hasn't been there awhile?  something about it helping insulate but wouldn't affect your freeze line for some time?  again, internet stuff, even though in writing is just someone's opinion  :-)   And I read somewhere about putting your electric line in a separate conduit (would that work with heat tape?)... expensive BUT you can just pull it back through or feed new line through if you get some weird short or something.  Maybe even put the water line in a bigger conduit all together - doesn't air around a pipe that low in the ground actually hold warmth?      I put my electric line in conduit to my barn just for tree root issues.   
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kckc

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Re: Automatic Waterers revisited....
« Reply #18 on: November 06, 2015, 09:37:06 am »

saw this online too.... interesting... your hubby might check into these options.

Even underground water pipes can freeze. In colder climates, it’s important to insulate the underground water pipes to stop this from happening. However, this does present problems. What can you use for insulation? Remember, too, that it has to be strong enough to withstand the weight of the earth on top of it.

Step 1 - Types Of Insulation

There are two different ways of insulating underground water pipes. The first is watertight, and the second is intended to prevent water from soaking into the insulation. The first is undoubtedly better, although it takes more work.

Step 2 - Watertight Insulation

To create watertight insulation for water pipes, the water pipes needs to be inside a larger pipe. Use a 9 inch sewer pipe to hold the smaller water pipe. It can either be made of concrete or plastic. This will be the major cost of the project. Beyond that, you need as much expanded polystyrene as you can obtain. In many instances, people will be happy to give this away. You will need several pieces that are large enough to be cut so they fit in the sewer pipe as discs, with the centers cut out to hold the water pipe.

Step 3 - Construction

Place one disc of expanded polystyrene in the end of the sewer pipe and then feed the water pipe through it. Surround the water pipe with smaller pieces of expanded polystyrene within the water pipe for about 2 feet of its length, and then insert another disc. By alternating the small pieces and discs in this manner for the full length of the sewer pipe, you insulate the water pipes and also support them. It’s a very cheap and efficient method for insulating water pipes and has the bonus of being completely watertight.

Step 4 - Non Watertight

Another method that isn’t watertight is even simpler. Put 3 inches of gravel at the bottom of a 30 inch trench and then line the trench with heavy plastic sheeting. Cut rigid foam board insulation into strips that are 12 inches wide. Lay several of these strips (to a depth of 4 inches) on top of the plastic sheeting, then lay the water pipes on the insulation. Add insulation, also to a depth of 4 inches, on either side of the water pipes, then another 4 inches on top.

Fold the plastic sheeting over, so the sides completely cover the insulation and tape in place using heavy tape. Now, take another piece of plastic sheeting that’s 2 feet wide and drape it over the top of this package. Tape the edges in place along the side of the insulated package. This will prevent most moisture entering, although it won’t be watertight. Fill in the trench with soil. In the event of water entering the trench, it will seep through, and the insulation will become wet and ineffective.
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kckc

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Re: Automatic Waterers revisited....
« Reply #19 on: November 06, 2015, 09:43:10 am »

the water pipe surrounded by that insulating tube type insulation then pushed through septic pipe is what I read about.... you do it all above ground then roll the sewer pipe into your water line.   now how well it works I just don't know.   Don't use drain pipe because it has the ridges and cracks easier,    ooh... and look at this already insulated pipe...   http://www.insulseal.com/photos.html
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Karen

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Re: Automatic Waterers revisited....
« Reply #20 on: November 12, 2015, 06:33:16 am »

Our neighbor stopped by last night to see if he could help (come to find out he does the lions' share of the land clearing, excavating, gravel driveways, digging out septics, etc., in the area.  He knows the guy that excavated the property when our house was built, so he's going to give him a call to see if he can break up the red shale with his excavator, or if he'll need the hydraulic hammer on his backhoe to do it, but he said he can get us down under 4 feet.  If he doesn't need the hammer, it'll take a couple hours.  If he needs it, it'll take a day and John will need to use his backhoe to dig out the rock he breaks off....but he's confident he can get us below the frost line.

He also said he had the equipment to clear our entire property in a few days.  He suggested we clear in the middle of winter, pile it all up in the middle and burn.  I don't want the ENTIRE property cleared (32 acres), but I'd LOVE 15 cleared, so we'll heave to see.  John couldn't get a firm daily rate out of him, so once the trench is dug, we'll have a better idea if we can throw a couple grand at him this winter to get a nice amount of property cleared.

And the saga continues....
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Karen

Walkin45

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Re: Automatic Waterers revisited....
« Reply #21 on: November 12, 2015, 07:01:45 am »

That's great, Karen.  I've decided in the Nelson, when and if.  I'm also thinking of pouring a large slab to place my round bale feeder on, to keep the mud down.  Since I'll have to pour a slab for the waterer.
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kckc

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Re: Automatic Waterers revisited....
« Reply #22 on: November 12, 2015, 07:08:45 am »

Hey Walkin - you don't want your waterer too close to your hay - almost all of my horses carry hay to the waterer and they can really get a lot of debris in one (mine anyway).  Mine also stand at the hay and just poo standing right there so I'd position my waterer where it wouldn't be near a standing butt area !  :-)  (and slant the slab where you want water to flow and to facilitate spraying off when needed)
Karen, glad you found some options for your waterer. 
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Karen

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Re: Automatic Waterers revisited....
« Reply #23 on: November 12, 2015, 07:26:01 am »

Carol, if you pour a slab for your round bale feeder, let me know how it works out.  We REALLY don't want to switch hay suppliers so we may need to switch to round bales next summer/fall.  If we do, we're going to get a hay hut, and we'll need to dry up a portion of the paddock (gravel, stone dust) but I hadn't thought about a cement slab.  I figured we'd put a couple of pallets down in the hay hut to get the hay up off the ground.
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kckc

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Re: Automatic Waterers revisited....
« Reply #24 on: November 12, 2015, 07:43:13 am »

I personally am not sure I would want my horses standing on concrete all day eating...  Until I was able to move my hay hut several times a month I planned on putting down big rock (not rip rap but not pea gravel).  I had started looking into this product  https://www.lighthoof.com/   - haven't done any further research into it but you guys might find it interesting
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Karen

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Re: Automatic Waterers revisited....
« Reply #25 on: November 17, 2015, 01:06:54 pm »

I wouldn't pour a slab large enough for the horses to stand on...just one large enough to keep the round bale up out of the mud/muck and under the hay hut.  I have enough hay to get me until probably July 1, 201

Bob the builder (our neighbor) contacted the guy who excavated our property when the house was built, and sure enough, they had to blast for the foundation and the water supply line from the well.  He did say that the red rock we've run into is pretty soft and usually peels back in layers, so he's hoping his excavator can handle it...and he doesn't hit any of the grey stuff.  If he does, he'll bring in the hammer attachment and get us down to 5 feet.  He'll be out on Monday to do it.  He'll also bring in sand, get the electrical conduit and water line laid and the ditch filled back in for us. 

He has to rent a cement drill on Saturday for another job, so he'll swing by with it sometime on Saturday to put a 5" hole in our basement wall....woo hoo? 

So if all goes well, I should be expanding the paddock to include the automatic waterer location next weekend.  This has turned into a WAY bigger deal than expected, but it should be worth it (at least I better think it was worth it come February).

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Karen

KysaSD

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Re: Automatic Waterers revisited....
« Reply #26 on: January 11, 2016, 09:42:10 am »

Just thought I would add a comment to this thread.  I put in a new Ritchie waterer last summer, same as Karen's but with two bowls, and along a fenceline so it waters two paddocks.  Our coldest overnight so far was minus 16 and everything is working perfectly!
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Kysa, South Dakota, 2 Mountain Horses, a Curly Foxtrotter, a TWH and a Mini, yes, I am crazy!

Karen

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Re: Automatic Waterers revisited....
« Reply #27 on: January 11, 2016, 01:20:10 pm »

Kysa, how deep in your water line?
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Karen

KysaSD

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Re: Automatic Waterers revisited....
« Reply #28 on: January 11, 2016, 01:46:54 pm »

6 feet.  That is standard here.
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Kysa, South Dakota, 2 Mountain Horses, a Curly Foxtrotter, a TWH and a Mini, yes, I am crazy!
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